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Thor96 |
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Sully, Interesting chronology. I don't know if I was ever aware of that.
You may not be able to teach an old dog new tricks, but an old dog can teach the pups a trick or two".
Thor
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sully |
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Thor, the Civil War began April 12, 1861. Lincoln issued an executive order freeing the slaves on Sept. 22, 1862. A little more than a year after the beginning
of the Civil War. "My paramount object in this struggle, is to save the Union and it not either to save or destroy slavery. If I could save the Union
without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it..." --Abraham Lincoln
"Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so!"
Ronald Reagan |
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TexasEd62 |
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The chronology is correct, but it doesn't prove anything.
The South may have not seceded because Lincoln freed the slaves, but they did because they feared that the institution of slavery was threatened by his election in 1861. That's why he was called a "Black Republican" in the South. The same fears caused them to reject "Popular Sovereignty" in the 1850s, which would have banned slavery in any new territories. Ironically enough, to protect slavery in effect they even rejected their banner cause of "States Rights" by rejecting Popular Sovereignty. The same fears almost caused their ancestors to wreck the American Revolution. If we want to add to the chronology we can keep in mind that they had even been willing to break ties with the other colonies over the issue in 1776. And it is true that preserving the Union not dealing with slavery was the paramount concern early in the war, but the Emancipation Proclamation rejuvenated the struggle in the north, support of which had began to wane by that point. And, if we are to adjust the focus a little more the Emancipation Proclamation only freed the slaves in the states in rebellion. Chattel Slavery was not abolished in the U.S. until the 13th Amendment was passed in December, 1865. To many, many, many white people in the South, non-slave owners more so than even slave owners, the "Peculiar Institution" was the "Beloved Institution" that protected them and their familes from "Nat-Turner like" slave revolts. Slave revolts had been feared in the South for almost two centuries and even more so since the early 1800s. That was never more so than to the non-slave owning Confederate soldier who relied on the Institution to protect his family while he was away fighting "Northern Aggression." The American Civil War, or what ever one may term it (war of the rebellion, war of northern aggression etc.) is a very complicated issue. Much more complicated than what we all learned in school. TexasEd |
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Thor96 |
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TexasEd62 wrote:You got that right. And the pundits will be arguing its cause til the cows come home. Two things can be said definitly. Slaves were technically freed. And state rights were lost and a pattern laid for further and further centralization until states have no rights. We are at a crucial dilemma now where the last wall is in jeopardy. In the process, we will slide into Marxism and lose any symblance of free enterprise.
You may not be able to teach an old dog new tricks, but an old dog can teach the pups a trick or two".
Thor
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AlleyOop007 |
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Thor96 wrote:Another little known or publicized fact is that there were black slave owners in the South at the time of the Northern War of Aggression. I recall that a prominent free black barber in Natches, Mississippi, owned several plantations with slaves prior to and during the war and there was another female mulatto that had property and slaves near Jacksonville, Florida, where she raised coastal cotton. I visited both areas where we (the National Park Service) were restoring the properties for interpretation.
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Thor96 |
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we were restoring the properties for interpretationSo you and Arch have something in common?
You may not be able to teach an old dog new tricks, but an old dog can teach the pups a trick or two".
Thor
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velvetnsteel |
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I think States Rights is a key. I applaud sully's posts about the common man running for office, and that must include every level of government. The state
legislatures MUST start exercising their Constitutional rights and tell the Feds to go push a rope somewhere. I fear it is already too late however.
The power under the constitution will always be in the people. It is intrusted for certain defined purposes, and for a certain limited period, to representatives of their own choosing; and, whenever it is executed contrary to their interest, or not agreeable to their wishes, their servants can and undoubtedly will be recalled. GEORGE WASHINGTON, letter to Bushrod Washington, Nov. 10, 1787 |
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IZH27 |
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Fella's,
Isn't the present admin and congress in the act of reparation? It seems that much of the wealth distribution is an act of reparation and the decimation of the economy a potential attempt to undermine the wealthy in America. Do any of you yet feel that loss of your blood and fortune is a worthy price to secure the freedom of your posterity?
"Remove far from me falsehood and lying; give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with the food that is needful for me, lest I be full and deny you and
say, "Who is the Lord?" or lest I be poor and steal and profane the name of my God.". Proverbs 30:8-9
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sully |
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IZ, I have felt for some time that loss of my blood and fortune are a worthy price. However, we need to attempt other means as well. That is the reason that I
advocate the common man running for office at the local, state, and federal levels. Call it a civilized revolution if you will. But, it is possible to
accomplish. Many people are waking up, unfortunately a little late, but not too late. I prefer for the Russian Prof. to not be right in his prediction about
the coming break up of America (civil war). But, if it comes down to that I will gladly sacrifice blood and fortune.
"Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so!"
Ronald Reagan |
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velvetnsteel |
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I agree with sully. Our blood and fortunes will be worthless shortly.
The power under the constitution will always be in the people. It is intrusted for certain defined purposes, and for a certain limited period, to representatives of their own choosing; and, whenever it is executed contrary to their interest, or not agreeable to their wishes, their servants can and undoubtedly will be recalled. GEORGE WASHINGTON, letter to Bushrod Washington, Nov. 10, 1787 |
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IZH27 |
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I pray that we see a change and aren't required to take such drastic measures.
"Remove far from me falsehood and lying; give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with the food that is needful for me, lest I be full and deny you and
say, "Who is the Lord?" or lest I be poor and steal and profane the name of my God.". Proverbs 30:8-9
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TexasEd62 |
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Yes, slavery was a rich man's game, regardless of race. Although it was rare some well-to-do blacks owned slaves. There was a free black man near Tyler
Texas who owned slaves. Another complication to the explanation public education gave us.
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cosmo05 |
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Apologize for what? One of my ancestors in the Union Army died at Gettysburg July 2nd in the peach orchard. The other side of my family came from Italy in
1906, I guess they are somehow responsible too. How about apologizing to me for apologizing on my behalf for something I was not remotely involved or
responsible for. You can guess where they can pack their apology. These people need to get a real life and get over it.
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Thor96 |
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How about apologizing to me for apologizing on my behalf for something I was not remotely involved or responsible for.Would you call that Apologation without representation? I'm not apologizing.
You can't teach an old dog new tricks, but an old dog can teach the pups a few tricks". Thor
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TexasEd62 |
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Thor96 wrote:That's quite funny Thor96. But since its those blowhards in the Senate and soon in Congress doing it on our behalf, how about "Apologation with mis-representation." TexasEd |
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Thor96 |
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TexasEd62 wrote:Ed, I stand corrected. It is MIS-representation.
You can't teach an old dog new tricks, but an old dog can teach the pups a few tricks". Thor
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velvetnsteel |
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They are very quick to want to apologize for everything but THEIR OWN ACTIONS.
The power under the constitution will always be in the people. It is intrusted for certain defined purposes, and for a certain limited period, to representatives of their own choosing; and, whenever it is executed contrary to their interest, or not agreeable to their wishes, their servants can and undoubtedly will be recalled. GEORGE WASHINGTON, letter to Bushrod Washington, Nov. 10, 1787 |
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TexasEd62 |
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The editor emeritus of The Washington Time in an article in Friday's (July 10th) paper claims that Representative Steve Cohen is the main pusher for the
apology. And it seems that Cohen, who represents a district in Memphis that is 98% black is facing a politically strong black opponent in next years election,
Willie Herrington the very popular mayor of Memphis, who has stepped down to run against him. Cohen, by the way once tried to join the Congressional Black
Caucus, but was rejected (He is not black).
Can you say "ulterior motives?" |
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BWCRITCH |
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TexasEd62 wrote:Can you say a "typical" politician? |
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