Base model for a good home defense shotgun.

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IZH27	Base model for a good home defense shotgun.	Lead	[-]
Posts: 1438 (05/02/09 8:56 PM) Contributing Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Tags : None I thought that I'd start here since this isn't really a sporterizing question. I've been thinking of a tactical style shotgun. I like the looks of the Benelli Tactical and am getting used to the FN Herstal Police Tactical. However, they are a bit pricey! If you were to start with a base shotgun and add sights, extended tube, grip and stock what would you consider a good base to begin with? What is easiest and most cost effective to build? "Remove far from me falsehood and lying; give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with the food that is needful for me, lest I be full and deny you and say, "Who is the Lord?" or lest I be poor and steal and profane the name of my God.". Proverbs 30:8-9
BWCRITCH		#1	[-]
Posts: 502 (05/02/09 9:28 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Go buy a mossburg 500, or my favorite 590 with the standard butstock, and no pistol grip. I have both, the 500 with the pistol grip is nice and easy to control, but the 590 is nice because you can "upper cut" some one with the butt of the gun a lot easier, so shooting does not have to be the only way to use it.
SW28fan		#2	[-]
Posts: 978 (05/02/09 9:29 PM) MODERATOR Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Why not a Mossberg 590? "Politicians are the only people in the world who create problems and then campaign against them"
Thor96		#3	[-]
Posts: 6969 (05/02/09 9:51 PM) MODERATOR Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	I think you would have to ask the question: What do you want a home defense shotgun to do? Shoot somebody? Doesn't require much. But if you are in close order combat, you need something more. The whole time I was in the Army, I never thought a lot about that steel buttplate, but Critch made me think. You wouldn't want a padded butt for close order combat. That steel buttplate was intended to do some bodily harm on a face, bust a chin, nose, whatever it comes in contact with. If you know how to use it, you can kill somebody without firing a shot. This alone causes me to rethink the pistol grip design on so many so called defense guns. IZH, I think this calls for some thinking about how you intend to use it. Equally important, if you haven't had military training, you might want to consider getting some kind of training on how to use a defense weapon. I know how, but I doubt the average person without training would know how. When all else fails, BLAME BUSH!
pepperbelly		#4	[-]
Posts: 4075 (05/02/09 10:31 PM) MODERATOR Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	I used to carry a Mossberg 500 when I was a cop. It had a pistol grip only. It was useful for searching a building, but a short buttstock would have helped a lot. I think a shotgun with a buttstock and a pistol grip would be more easily controlled in close combat. Jim NRA Life Member Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. --- Thomas Jefferson.
BWCRITCH		#5	[-]
Posts: 503 (05/03/09 6:40 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Jim, The problem I have with my 500 with a pistol grip and collapsible stock is first if you hit someone with that plastic stock they will not be happy, but will it effective to lay someone out? Next is if you have that pistol grip and you try to do anything other than clear a building it sucks. In fact you can not even use it as another weapon. As for my 590 which is 2 inch's longer, and has the ability to hold 8 in the tube if you want, has the standard hard plastic butt stock you can easily knock someone out cold with that.
Thor96		#6	[-]
Posts: 6972 (05/03/09 7:15 AM) MODERATOR Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Jim, would you agree that once you pull that trigger, there is a higher degree of accountability? I expect as an officer, you would be suspended pending investigation at the least, and the investigation would be tough as you would probably have to answer the question, "was there another way". Private citizen would not be subject to all that an officer is, but unless your state has the Castle Law, you could be charged with a felony, even if it happened in your home. So a butt swing or thrust may be the better option in some situations. So I would opt for a butt stock sturdy enough for the chop, and even a steel plate. When all else fails, BLAME BUSH!
IZH27		#7	[-]
Posts: 1439 (05/03/09 7:25 AM) Contributing Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	I researched the 500 and 590 a bit. Looks like the 500 mag tube can't be extended. What load/loads are best? I have some 3 and 2 3/4 00 buckshot loads and some 2 3/4 slugs 1 oz. In combo or straight out 00 in the tube? "Remove far from me falsehood and lying; give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with the food that is needful for me, lest I be full and deny you and say, "Who is the Lord?" or lest I be poor and steal and profane the name of my God.". Proverbs 30:8-9
BWCRITCH		#8	[-]
Posts: 504 (05/03/09 8:57 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Well I was going to show you a picture of mine, but the image loader will not load, so I will describe it to you. I keep 6 shells in the tube. Those shells that I keep in the tube are 2 3/4 #6 bird shot. The reason for this is it will not go threw every wall in the house, but from across the room it will still do the job, and since I might be shooting at night, in low light I do not have to be as dead on. On the side of my 590 I have a 6 shell holder, in it I keep 2 #2 shot shells, 2 00 shot shells, and 2 1oz slugs. Now remember I did say it holds 8 in the tube, this gives me the opportunity to put a larger shell in with out compromising what I already have. Now I also have a light rail on the end of the barrel, but I have not put one on yet, but I will be putting a very bright light with a pressure switch so I can always blind someone if I need, or use it as a means to help aim.
BWCRITCH		#9	[-]
Posts: 505 (05/03/09 9:00 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Also read this. It has some good info, and then go to the range and practice it for your self. http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu83.htm
IZH27		#10	[-]
Posts: 1440 (05/03/09 4:12 PM) Contributing Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Thanks BW, Good info. Your mag loading rational makes sense. "Remove far from me falsehood and lying; give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with the food that is needful for me, lest I be full and deny you and say, "Who is the Lord?" or lest I be poor and steal and profane the name of my God.". Proverbs 30:8-9
pepperbelly		#11	[-]
Posts: 4077 (05/03/09 5:07 PM) MODERATOR Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	I wasn't recommending a collapsible buttstock. I prefer a regular buttstock with no pistol grip. If there was a pistol grip and a regular buttstock, or a slightly shorter buttstock it would be good for a defense shotgun. A shotgun with a pistol grip makes a poor sporting shotgun. As for using birdshot that theory has become less popular. Birdshot isn't a good stopper. As for shooting through walls keep in mind that #00 is all the police use. Your first priority is a defense round. A light mounted on the weapon is necessary. I don't think a large capacity magazine is needed though. You aren't fighting a battle. Those extensions have become very popular but you just won't be firing that many rounds in a home defense situation. A Mossberg 500 with an 18.5" barrel and regular buttstock would be a good defense shotgun. If you want more tactical get a Benelli Super 90. Jim NRA Life Member Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. --- Thomas Jefferson.
BWCRITCH		#12	[-]
Posts: 506 (05/03/09 5:29 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	pepperbelly wrote: I wasn't recommending a collapsible buttstock. I prefer a regular buttstock with no pistol grip. If there was a pistol grip and a regular buttstock, or a slightly shorter buttstock it would be good for a defense shotgun. A shotgun with a pistol grip makes a poor sporting shotgun. As for using birdshot that theory has become less popular. Birdshot isn't a good stopper. As for shooting through walls keep in mind that #00 is all the police use. Your first priority is a defense round. A light mounted on the weapon is necessary. I don't think a large capacity magazine is needed though. You aren't fighting a battle. Those extensions have become very popular but you just won't be firing that many rounds in a home defense situation. A Mossberg 500 with an 18.5" barrel and regular buttstock would be a good defense shotgun. If you want more tactical get a Benelli Super 90. Jim Jim, First off 00 for LEO's is one thing, but when there is a standing chance that a family member is only a couple of walls away than I would rather stop someone with bird shot, and I say this with the intent of firing at someone only feet away. This is why I also have the other rounds to play with. For example if someone is trying to break down my front door, then a slug or 00 will go in, and if it looks like the perp. is about to make it all the way in before the cops get there, then game on. But as for the bird shot in the tube already I would rather have that ready to go first. As for large capacity, well I have to views for that. First is I like the larger capacity so I can keep a few rounds ready to go, but can easily put something else in the gun with out down loading. Second I would rather have a whole lot extra then 1 not enough.
fabber39		#13	[-]
Posts: 11 (05/04/09 4:16 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	HEY!! IZH27, check your lodal pawn shops for the Mossberg knock off's, like New Haven, Revaliation, and other store brands. These usually sell under $100.00, hack the barrel off at 19", and pull the plug out of the magazine, and there you go!! That's what I did, but be sure to look for the double rail pump arms, theyre more reliable. the fabber39
IZH27		#14	[-]
Posts: 1442 (05/04/09 8:54 PM) Contributing Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	I think I've found what I was looking for!! My home defense shotgun. "Remove far from me falsehood and lying; give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with the food that is needful for me, lest I be full and deny you and say, "Who is the Lord?" or lest I be poor and steal and profane the name of my God.". Proverbs 30:8-9
MasterCork		#15	[-]
Posts: 470 (05/04/09 9:28 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	Ours is a Mossie 500, loaded with #4 buckshot, tac sights, Lazar dot, pistol grip, adjustable stock, grip on the slide. Fired it to check the pattern, inside a house it would be a hole maker. Have a couple old single shot and one double barrel 12 gauge shotguns, beat up and nothing fancy. If it ever turns into 'road warrior time', 'SHTF', whatever one calls it, they get the hacksaw reduction to be street sweepers. Heck might even do my Browning gold if it gets that ugly. Been thinking of a 410 tarsus Judge with 3" chambers, crimson sight grips. But having 12 ga's and shot-shells for my 38 when out clearing fence rows in snakes areas have delayed the purchase. Cork .......if you see me running.......shoot the man behind me!....
BWCRITCH		#16	[-]
Posts: 507 (05/05/09 4:13 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	IZH27 wrote: I think I've found what I was looking for!! My home defense shotgun. Yeah I had one, but there is no place to mount my laser, and it is a little heavy.
Thor96		#17	[-]
Posts: 6977 (05/05/09 6:24 AM) MODERATOR Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	IZH27 wrote: I think I've found what I was looking for!! My home defense shotgun. EGADS! That's not home defense. That's WAR! That's Cork's SHTF. Speaking of Cork: Ours is a Mossie 500, loaded with #4 buckshot I was just about to suggest turkey load. It's heavier than the squirrel/bird load but not as penetrating (thru a wall) as slug or double 00. What do I know. All I've got handy is my 45ACP When all else fails, BLAME BUSH!
rkba857		#18	[-]
Posts: 475 (05/05/09 6:49 AM) Contributing Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	The Mossberg is a good gun but, I prefer the Remington 870. Smooth and dependable. You can buy aftermarket or used barrels anywhere. With the wood stock it makes a #+!#@%! club. #2 or #4 buck is good or one of the Remington combo turkey loads. You're only talking about across the room distances for home defense (20 feet or less unless your castle is a real castle). You can put an extended magazine tube on it and mount a laser or flashlight on it. Just my 2 cents worth.
pepperbelly		#19	[-]
Posts: 4078 (05/05/09 7:27 AM) MODERATOR Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	I remember passing up a chance to buy a street sweeper back in the '80s. 50 rounds of 12ga goodness. I am starting to hate hindsight! Jim NRA Life Member Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. --- Thomas Jefferson.
BWCRITCH		#20	[-]
Posts: 509 (05/05/09 3:10 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts Report Post	rkba857 wrote: The Mossberg is a good gun but, I prefer the Remington 870. Smooth and dependable. You can buy aftermarket or used barrels anywhere. With the wood stock it makes a #+!#@%! club. #2 or #4 buck is good or one of the Remington combo turkey loads. You're only talking about across the room distances for home defense (20 feet or less unless your castle is a real castle). You can put an extended magazine tube on it and mount a laser or flashlight on it. Just my 2 cents worth. I am not a big fan of the 870. Not to say it is not a good, gun, but you really have to watch your finger when you reload, and if you still have the gun up to your shoulder and are trying to reload.......... ouch.

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Base model for a good home defense shotgun.

Base model for a good home defense shotgun.

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